[RPG] How to make a D&D 3.5e veteran get used to the 4e roleplaying style

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I have a good friend in my 4e group who is good when it comes to roleplaying his character, but he's always been a dedicated 3.5e player, to the point of avoiding 4e and even Pathfinder completely. He's one of those "why would I try anything else?" kinds of roleplayers. I managed to entice him into our game mostly because of the plot, but he isn't managing to grasp the logic of how 4e works.

  • He made a Dragonborn fighter, and ever since he's been complaining that he lacks the low-light vision that the elf and halfling have.

  • He seems to not understand that powers have no improvisational uses during skill challenges:

    • trying to cut ropes with fire-based at-will powers
    • trying to make the Psion use Far Hand or Far Push to launch him through gaps
    • trying to then "exhale smoke" from his mind and use an at-will to light wood on fire
  • Another time he tried to get the sorcerer to use a Dragonfrost at-will to extinguish lanterns during a fight, when he could have done just by standing beside them and using a Minor Action.

  • Yesterday we were fighting a giant shadow solo monster with a weakness to radiant damage, but he argued it was illogical that it wasn't weak to fire powers if it was weak to light-based powers.

  • He's also been asking for the cleric's Rebuke Undead to act like the original so he can use it as a ritual and one-shot undead

  • He's asked to use the flames of his Flaming Weapon +1 for roleplaying purposes and to disarm traps, etc.

And so on.

Though the rest of my players do seem to understand that powers outside of combat can't be used to solve challenges unless they're utility powers or skills, he seems to want to add extra rules to every single combat power.

Despite all that he hasn't been disruptive, and a fair share of the other players look to him as a "leader" because of his attitude, mannerisms and character. Still, it's really disruptive to have a D&D veteran trying to turn 4e's logic into something more like 3.5's logic. I see 4e more akin to Final Fantasy Tactics and such.

It's becoming really annoying since the rest of the players follow the rules as written and like them, but they refuse to help me talk to him since they feel it's my job as the DM to do so. And believe me, I've talked to him.

Best Answer

Disclaimer: I have never played DnD 4th Edition.

There seem to be two different things this player is doing that are causing a problem for you, and I'm going to address them separately. I'll start with the simpler of the two.

Your player wants to contradict the rules.

He made a Dragonborn fighter, and since that moment he's been complaining about how he lacks low-light vision but our elf and halfing have it.

... he argued it was illogical it wasn't weak to fire powers since light sources should damage him, and so on.

He's also been asking for Rebuke Undead on the Cleric to become like the original where he can use it as a ritual and one-shot undeads ...

In these situations your player wants something he liked in other games, or because he feels it "makes sense" in the real world. For this, you're going to have to come down on the side of the rules here. The innate abilities of races, the separation of elemental damage types, and the design of combat powers are all a part of the game's balance. To give him these things would be unfair to the other players, who are working within the limits set up by the system.

Now, your player isn't going to like this, because he wants to do more "cool" stuff and his view is clearly that the system is holding him back in this respect. This brings us to the second part.

Your player wants to expand the rules.

Also, he seems to fail to understand Powers hold no real trole playing value, as he's been trying to cut ropes with fire at-will powers during sequences, trying to make the Psion use Far Hand or Far Push to impulse him thru gaps to den "exhale smoke" from his mind and use an at-will to burn wood, all of it on a skill challenge. He also tried to make the sorceror use Dragonfrost At-Will to extinguish lanters during a fight, that they could do my standing besides them and using a Minor Action.

Now, where above there was some real risk of your player unbalancing himself with respect to the other players and diminishing their fun, here the player is asking for things that can make the game fun for everyone. He's chafing at the idea that combat powers can't possibily be used out of combat. Why? Because it doesn't make sense.

You should allow the player to use his combat powers out of combat. There is a nice article preserved by the Internet Archive on this. The relevant tweaks are:

  1. Make your players explain how the power fits. Sometimes just the name of the power alone will fit the situation, but allow your players flexibility. As long as they explain how that power represents the character’s approach and mindset, everything is going well.
  2. Give them a bonus. Don’t give anything for at-wills, or your ranger is going to constantly be “twin-striking” in conversation. An encounter is worth +2 to a skill check, and a Daily is worth +6. Why so much? Because the PC is going to expend that power, and if they are expending a daily power to accomplish something, they should stand a good chance of success.

The gist of it is that powers do something, and they should certainly also do that something outside of combat. If he wants to try and burn an object with a combat fire power, then treat it as an attack on the object. Just because there's a non-power way of doing something doesn't mean that you have to stop the players from having fun with it.

Your player wants to have fun.

Your ultimate goal at the table isn't to enforce the rules as laid out by Wizards of the Coast. Your ultimate goal is to have a good time with your friends. If you deviate from the rules in little ways that don't harm the balance of the game in order to make it more fun, then so much the better to you.

If you adopt the bonus rule quoted above, share it with your players. You might find they'll do more interesting things out of combat with this reward. And they'll know that using an at-will won't have any mechanical benefit, but it could still seem awesome.

I find it's always best to err on the side of awesome.