[RPG] How to prevent players from using Persuasion or Deception to weasel their way out of a murder

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Background

My players accepted a quest to basically be drug mules, delivering illicit goods to a faraway town. While alone with the NPC giving the assignment, they decided to kill him and take the shipment of illicit goods for themselves. The NPC they killed was part of a large tribe of ruthless orcs, and they knew this when they decided to kill him. They had encountered the tribe before, and were on speaking terms with them.

They buried the body, but what they don't know is that the orc had told his friends that he was making a deal and that if anything happened to him, the PCs would be to blame.

The problem

I want the players to realize that killing random people without precedent has repercussions. If they see the group of orcs again, the orcs will want their blood.

What I want to avoid: getting out of this with no consequences.

I don't think that any persuasion roll, or deception roll, would be good enough to dissuade a large group of orcs from wanting to tear them limb from limb. But I also don't want the players to feel like they're being railroaded.

I'm not trying to avoid a battle with the orcs. I'd rather that had to battle with the orcs than be able to lie about having killed one of their tribesmen unprovoked.

What I need help with

I am unsure of how to deal with the orcs not being open to reason with the players without it feeling "cheap," in that they can't use deception or persuasion (ability checks) against the orcs to avoid the angry orcs who want their vengeance.

What a good answer will help me do

It seems fair to have the orcs be too angry to reason with next time they see them. How do I use the game to reflect that?

How can I prevent the party from being able to bluff or persuade the orcs without the loss of player agency?

Best Answer

Treat the Orcs as though they are an organized crime family.

If you murder a member of the Mafia, or one of the nefarious narco gangs of the modern age, do you think you'll get away with it? Will there be a bounty out on your head?

Make the party an offer they can't refuse (Movie ref: The Godfather)

A simple way to get your point across is an ambush/encounter with a large enough group of orcs from that tribe that this party can't defeat. The party is to return the contraband, pay a weregild for the death of that orc, and then they owe the current orc chief a favor. The offer they can't refuse is made by the orc tribe chief: Go get me {this Macguffin} and I call off my other bounty hunters! (Let's say he wants a prize bull owned by a lord not far away, as he wants to improve the stock of his cattle herd since his daughter needs a bigger dowry for the marriage to that other orc clan he's been dealing with...)

If they see the group of Orcs again, they'll all want their blood.

Yes, they will. You are not railroading your players if their in-game actions have consequences. As a consequence of their actions, they are now marked for vengeance or death by an orc tribe.

I don't think any persuasion roll would be good enough to dissuade a large group of Orcs from wanting to tear them limb from limb.
Is it fair to have the orcs be too angry to reason with next time they see them?
How can I prevent them from being able to bluff or persuade without the loss of player agency?

Deception/Persuasion checks with disadvantage

Yes, it's fair for the orcs to (at least at first) not be inclined to parley or listen. Attempts at persuasion/deception can, based on these circumstances, certainly be ruled to have disadvantage. You don't need to prevent the party from trying, but they are not guaranteed to succeed simply by trying to persuade or deceive a given group of orcs. You can either

  1. Set the DC for making a successful check very high (20+)
  2. and/or apply disadvantage
  3. During the next encounter where they try to parley with the orcs, provide the party with clues and descriptions that explicitly signal to them that "a negotiation is not currently an option."

The DM can also decide that circumstances influence a roll in one direction or the other and grant advantage or impose disadvantage as a result. (PHB, Chapter 7, "Using Ability Checks")

But you don't need to roll for this. A roll is only called for when a result or an outcome is uncertain (PHB, p. 171, Using Ability Scores). The orcs are certainly upset.

The orcs might want to capture the party to bring them to justice before the orc tribe (Which might be fatal). Or, a band of orcs (calculate the encounter difficulty to hard or deadly) becomes the posse who chases the party down to capture or kill them: wanted, dead or alive! The party are now fugitives.

This isn't a railroad

This response by the orcs is the game world reacting in a rational fashion to the actions of the characters. But maybe a given orc posse can't take them out. (Back to the "offer you can't refuse" idea). The party is in no position to negotiate with the vengeful orcs (to get the tribe to stop sending hit squads out after them) without leverage of some sort. What does the party have as leverage?

  1. The contraband?
  2. Some of the orcs (captured) from the posse?
  3. Something else? (A unique ability the chief wants them to use on his behalf? A paladin who can, for example, cure the disease of his aunt?)

For the party to make a deal, role play the negotiations after they've had at least one group of orcs try to take them out. Put the orc chief in the role of crime/gangster boss who wants what's his, and a little bit more.

A TPK is also a valid response, but use these with great care

If luck is not with them and the orc posse defeats the party or the battle results in a TPK, that's the luck of the dice ... but you can always choose to rule that the orcs stabilize and capture/revive one of the players (or more) to be taken to the tribe and then imprisoned, enslaved, what have you.

Or the whole party gets enslaved. Now the adventure hook is: escape!

Make their mistake part of the adventure.


Ability checks aren't magic

@Ben made a comment about ability checks that is worth capturing here.

Persuasion isn't mind control. The party, or the party face, can succeed at a persuasion check without the orcs doing exactly what the party wants. For example, a success at persuasion calms the orcs down enough or muddies the waters enough that they're willing to entertain the party making amends, rather than the orcs only pursuing bloody revenge! There are still consequences, the party face gets to feel like they saved everyone's bacon, and you get a story hook out of it in how the amends are made.