[RPG] What are the differences between Holmes, Moldvay, and Mentzer D&D

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What are the differences between Holmes, Moldvay, and Mentzer D&D? Also, which one came first?

Best Answer

History

D&D started as a series of little booklets, now called "original D&D" (OD&D). These booklets were basically barely-edited versions of the house rules of Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson.

Holmes Basic Dungeons & Dragons book In 1977, TSR hired J. Eric Holmes to develop a Basic D&D game. This was a dark blue, boxed set containing D&D in a single book, plus a module (B1 In Search of the Unknown), and some dice (or cardboard chits, when they ran out!).

Moldvay and Mentzer are game designers who took the old Basic D&D game (edited by Eric Holmes) and revised them. Both produced "red box" versions of the game. You'll find far more differences between Holmes and the later red boxes than you'll find between Moldvay and Mentzer.

Moldvay Basic Dungeons & Dragons book Tom Moldvay revised the "Basic" D&D game in 1981. It came in a red box and featured the B2 Keep on the Borderlands module. It came with dice (and a marking crayon!). These rules handled levels 1-3. David "Zeb" Cook wrote the follow-on "Expert" rule book (another boxed set) that expanded the game to levels 4-14.

Mentzer Basic Dungeons & Dragons book Frank Mentzer revised the game again in 1983 with another "red box" set featuring the art of Larry Elmore. This time, the Dungeon Master book was separated from the Player book. Mentzer would continue the Basic (1-3) and Expert (4-14) classifications but would go on to produce additional expansions: Companion (15-25), Master (26-36), and Immortal (characters too sexy for their levels, but you essentially get 36 more). These separate books would later be combined into the D&D Rules Cyclopedia.

Differences between Holmes and Moldvay

Moldvay made many changes to the Holmes version to streamline play and make it easier for players to understand the game. Both games cover levels 1-3, though.

Overall differences:

Holmes' game includes B1 In Search of the Unknown. Moldvay's game includes B2 Keep on the Borderlands.
The Holmes version is intended as an introduction for Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, and refers the reader to there for further help. Moldvay Basic D&D is intended as its own game, with little connection to AD&D.
Holmes' book is a reference manual. Moldvay's book is an instruction manual.

Rules differences:

Holmes presents the game as rules to be followed. Moldvay presents the game as guidelines to be considered.
Holmes has initiative in order of dexterity (high to low). Moldvay has players roll group initiative.
Combat in Holmes is based on OD&D, which was based on Chainmail (more wargamey). The weapons all do 1d6 damage. Moldvay gives weapons individual damage ratings.
The spell Magic Missile requires a to-hit roll in Holmes, but not in Moldvay.
Holmes offers dozens of spells (level 1-3). Moldvay cuts this spell list a lot (from 18 to 3 3rd level spells, for instance).
In Holmes, not all ability scores have modifiers. Moldvay makes every ability count and provides bonus charts for each one, and most fall into the same seven bands (-3 to +3).
There are differences in advancement for classes. Elves in Holmes need far more XP to advance than in Moldvay.
Holmes has no surprise rules. Moldvay does, but they're essentially brought back in from OD&D.
Moldvay adds monster morale.
Moldvay adds automatic hits on a 20 and automatic misses on a 1.
Holmes carries forward the OD&D class name "Fighting Man." Moldvay shortened that to "Fighter" (probably copying Gygax in AD&D).

Differences between Moldvay and Mentzer

In general, the Mentzer version was a repackaging and expansion of the Moldvay version. The differences are minor in the Basic ruleset.

Overall differences:

Moldvay aims his writing at a younger audience. Mentzer writes for an adult audience.
The Moldvay version has weaker layout and art than the later Mentzer version.
Moldvay's game is pretty simple and straightforward. Mentzer adds complexity, like skills and weapon mastery.
Moldvay's red box came with B2 Keep on the Borderlands, but you could buy the books separately (unboxed). Mentzer's Basic box didn't come with a module (the Expert set came with X1 The Isle of Dread, though!).

Rule differences:

Moldvay stops at level 3 (and Cook's Expert set continues that to 14). Mentzer's "BECMI" continues on and on.
Moldvay states that clerics get their spells from gods. Mentzer gets all "wishy-washy"* about this aspect of the game and only says clerics get spells from "their beliefs."
Moldvay's magic-users get one spell at 1st level and have to find more in play. Mentzer's get one spell plus Read Magic at 1st level, and then one new one at every level.
The monster list changes between these versions. A number of people "monsters" are combined into the Human entry: acolyte, medium, trader, veteran. Insect swarm and noble are moved to the Expert rules. Some monsters are renamed: cave locust became locust, giant; driver ant became ant, giant; and killer bee became bee, giant.
Mentzer slows down the advancement of saving throws, thieves' abilities, and spell acquisition for clerics and magic-users.
Castle-building rules are more detailed in Moldvay, but Mentzer details a base town and talks about running town adventures.

Related Solutions

[RPG] AC differences between AD&D 1E and Basic D&D

Basic D&D has different Dex modifiers to AC, and different entries for armors worse than chain. The combination can result in up to a 2 point AC difference.

Note that AD&D2E has the same AC's as 1E, but has more armors; I've put the ones not in 1E PH in (parentheses).

_____________________ Armor for a given AC _______________________
AC  Basic           Advanced D&D 1E (2E)             Labyrinth Lord
10  --- . . . . . . None . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ---
 9  No Armor  . . . Shield Only  . . . . . . . . . . Unarmored 
 8  Shield Only . . Leather/Padded . . . . . . . . . Padded, Leather
 7  Leather . . . . Studded Leather, Ring Mail . . . Studded Leather
 6  Scale Mail  . . Scale, (Brigandine, Hide)  . . . Scale Mail
 5  Chain Mail  . . Chain Mail . . . . . . . . . . . Chain Mail
 4  Banded Mail . . Banded, Splint, (Bronze Plate) . Banded,Splint
 3  Plate Mail  . . Plate Mail . . . . . . . . . . . Plate Mail
 2  --- . . . . . . (Field Plate)  . . . . . . . . . ---
 1  --- . . . . . . (Full Plate) . . . . . . . . . . ---
 0  Suit Armor  . . ---  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ---

AC Dex Adjustment
Dex:             3  4  5  6  7-8 9-12 13-14 15  16  17 18-19 20-21 22-23
Basic D&D:      +3 +2 +2 +1  +1   +0   -1   -1  -2  -2   -3   -4    -5 
Advanced D&D 1: +4 +3 +2 +1  +0   +0   +0   -1  -2  -3   -4   --    --
Advanced D&D 2: +4 +3 +2 +1  +0   +0   +0   -1  -2  -3   -4   -5    -6
Labyrinth Ld:   +3 +2 +2 +1  +1   +0   -1   -1  -2  -2   -3   --    --

For monsters, you won't need to adjust at all. For characters, if AC is 6 or higher, you may want to adjust it.

References:
TSR2010 AD&D1E Player's Handbook, 6th printing, ©1980.
TSR2101 AD&D2E Player's Handbook Electronic Edition (from Core Rules 2.0 CD)
TSR1071 D&D Rules Cyclopedia Scanned/OCR'd Edition (From DTRPG)
GBD1001 Labyrinth Lord (No Art, via DTRPG.)

Edit Note: I added the LL data in for completeness.

[RPG] What are the differences between D&D 3.5 and D&D 4th edition

The two games are very different, despite sharing the same underpinnings. I know plenty of people who played previous editions who don't like 4e, and I know plenty of people who played previous editions who loved 4e. Hopefully we can navigate these rocky, contentious waters without flames.

First off, 4e is fairly light on non-combat rules. This doesn't mean that 4e games are all about combat; it means that the rules assume that a lot of the roleplaying activities that were codified in 3e will be done via freeform roleplay. For example, there aren't any crafting rules for anything other than magic items. There also aren't any general professional skills, and there aren't any NPC classes. If you prefer to have rules for that sort of thing, 3e will be a better choice for you.

Second, 4e uses a power-based design methodology. Classes can be thought of as collections of powers; the differences between classes are defined by the different power choices they have. This makes for a very modular and flexible system. Some people find that it makes the classes overly homogeneous; some people like it.

Third, every 4e class uses powers. That's implied by my second point but it's worth mentioning specifically. A character begins with two at-will powers, that he can use whenever he wants; one encounter power, that can be used once per fight; and one daily power, that can be used once per day. Even martial characters, such as warriors, use this paradigm -- although their "powers" might be better thought of as something akin to a martial arts kata. This was intended to make combat more interesting for (say) fighters, in comparison to the earlier model where fighters just tended to hit things over and over again. If you didn't mind that model, this change may be unnecessary for your play style.

Fourth, 4e leans more heavily on the battlemap. My impression is that the large number of movement-oriented powers both make the battlemap more important and make combat more fluid, but that's definitely a subjective opinion on my part: consider it something to think about if you try 4e rather than a definite fact.

Fifth, 4e introduces the concepts of roles. Roles are a way of classifying classes by what they tend to do in combat. You've got leaders, who heal. There are more of them than just the cleric; for example, the bard is also a leader. You've got defenders, who control the battlefield by encouraging enemies to focus their attacks on them. The fighter is a defender; so is the paladin. You've got controllers, who are somewhat difficult to define, but you can think of them as the classes that affect the flow of a fight: they can hamper enemies, reshape terrain, and so on. The wizard is a classic controller. And, finally, you've got strikers, who purely focus on doing damage. The ranger and the sorcerer are strikers. Every class is primarily one role, but every class has the ability to take on aspects of another role, depending on what the player wants to do.

Sixth, multiclassing is more limited than in 3e. You can multiclass in a couple of ways, but you don't get the same ability to take six or seven classes/prestige classes during the course of your career. 4e classes are fairly flexible, but you don't get the same complete freedom you would with 3e multiclassing.

Seventh, the scope and feel of 4e can be somewhat more epic; or, to put it differently, more broad. The highest level is level 30, and that's very epic play, with abilities that allow characters to come back from the dead. Even at level 1, your characters are significantly more durable than third edition characters, and they'll be able to pull off some really wild things.

I think that hits most of the major differences. It's good to remember that it's still a heroic fantasy game in which characters fight monsters. It still uses a 20 sided die. Also, if you want to try it out, WotC has a free Quick Start kit available.

Alternatively, the new Essentials Red Box will be out in a few weeks; at $20 US, it might be a good way to take a peek at the game and decide if you like it. The Essentials core books will present a bunch of new class variants that change some of the things above: e.g., fighters won't have the same power structure I mentioned. So that might be a better entrance point.